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  • Question about tommy polley

    Ok all of you defensive experts out there, question about tommy polley, who is going to be an unrestricted free agent at the end of 2004.

    Polley's 2004 cap charge is $816,500. Polley was not a first round pick and did not receive an enormous signing bonus. This is the last year of his rookie contract, and presumably, he is going to be looking for a serious raise come next year.

    Lets assume for a second that polley has another good but not great year for us, ie struggles again with some injuries and some inconsistent play. The kind of guy that you like to have on your team, but also the kind of guy that other teams tend to overpay for and deep talented teams like the rams have to let go since on the rams he most likely wont be considered a core player.

    How hard to we try and keep him? What nfl players at the outside linebacker position is his comparable to and what do they make?

    From everything i have read, we are taking a wait and see approach to polley and even if we sign Pace and open up some cap money for 2005, i havent seen anything that says we will try to lock polley up long term before the 2004 season. if anyone thinks we should be trying to lock him up, what price would you try to do so (ie pick an nfl player he is comparable to and what does that guy make). Will Polley take less to stay? I have no idea.

    If polley has a great year, he might price himself right off the rams' chart for next year (ie increasing the possibility that someone will pay money that we cant afford). If he gets hurt or regresses and chillar or one of the other linebackers steps up, maybe we arent interested in keeping him at all unless he takes way less to stay.

    I share the concern of many of you on these type of situations, which is the following. Not overpaying in the salary cap era is critical, but you need an alternative. Can we get another veteran next year who is comparable to polley for the same money. Do we have to use a #1 or #2 pick to replace him and hope for the best. Does Chillar, son of Ram, or one of the other guys step up and look like a future starter?

    Tx and all the other defensive gurus, please let us know your thoughts. My general observations from watching the traffic on the board are that nearly everyone is a Pisaite (aka 5-0 ite), most are Thomasites (with the caveat that he needs to stay healthy), but the feelings on Polley tend to be mixed. Is there a hard core Polleyite out there who wants to make the case for him as a core guy on the defense?

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel

  • #2
    Re: Question about tommy polley

    You're dead on with respect to the catch22 here. Polley has demonstrated flashes of being a top notch LB, but he has not been consistent - or consistently healthy.

    That said, if he stays healthy and has even a decent year, he'll probably be a blue-chip UFA next year. Its going to be tough to sign him.

    My feeling is that the Rams won't be able to resign him next year unless they clear some serious space by signing Pace to a cap friendly long term deal, and maybe restructuring older players like Faulk and Bruce. He may not be worth the effort, though, particularly if the DTs develop. If you have dominating DTs, even average LBs will play like Pro Bowlers, and paying top $ to Polley won't be necessary.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Question about tommy polley

      I think the urgency to resign Tommy Polley will be directly effected by how Chillar does this season. Obviously we won't necessarily need to resign Polley if Chillar looks like starter material.

      That said, it's a bit of a gamble. Polley is an established pro who has played well. I'd say see if you can negotiate a new deal before the start of the season, maybe with an incentive based contract that offers enough bonus money to make it rewarding for him but safe for us.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Question about tommy polley

        If Pace were signed to a long term deal I suppose the Rams could take a proactive approach and try to lock Polley up to a cap friendly long term deal. It's a tough call even if Pace were signed to a long term deal. Overall I think I would be inclined to let Polley play out his contract and keep the options open. I understand the concerns as far as an alternative, but there is no reason to believe that Chillar can't be the guy. If he can't, the options are still there to try and sign Polley or another FA.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Question about tommy polley

          I like Polley and we could do with him signed to long term deal but as always its what hes worth on the open market theres always someone who will pay more

          We could have done with keeping london but couldn't afford him I think this will happen with Polley.

          Lets hope Chiller steps up,

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Question about tommy polley

            I actually have a Polley jersey. Polley has his moments, but all in all seems to have the tools to be an awesome LB. He has speed, good coverage skills, but needs to improve on the run defense as does the whole unit. If Polley and the rest of this LB unit improves against the rush, we have to sign them all somehow. They are spaced out contractually that we may be able to afford this.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Question about tommy polley

              I agree Tx the longer they play together hopefully the better they will become

              What worries me regarding the contracts is when does archeleta's contract expire he was drafted in the same year

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Question about tommy polley

                Ramstiles, archuleta was a first round pick, meaning he signed a longer term contract than polley, typically seven years. we should be in good shape with archuleta for at least a couple of more years.

                ramming speed to all

                general counsel

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Question about tommy polley

                  Archuleta's contract expires after the 2005 season. :ramlogo:

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Question about tommy polley

                    thanks jake for the clarification, that surprises me quite a bit. I wonder why he only signed a four year deal since the first round picks often sign for six or seven. I would think that sometime after the 2004 season, after pace is signed, we would strongly consider trying to get an extension done with archuleta so he doesnt hit the free agent market. Health permitting of course.


                    general counsel

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Question about tommy polley

                      GA

                      I know archuleta was a first round pick and as disco says it expires after 2005 will we need to sort it out at the end of this year so we don't go into the last year and risk arch testing the waters of FA

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Question about tommy polley

                        The Rams should have cap space next season from Warners release. Polly is a talented LB and should be considered one of the leaders on D. Hopefully he stays healthy and plays to his potential this season. With all three starting LB's healthy, Thomas with one year at MLB under his belt, and Pisa (The next Jr. Seau IMO) the LB's should be a strong point on D. Overall I'm very optimistic that the defense will be just as strong or better than last year.
                        JUST WIN ONE FOR THE FANS
                        :ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram:

                        "HIT HARD, HIT FAST, AND HIT OFTEN"
                        Adm. William "Bull" Halsey

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Question about tommy polley

                          Originally posted by RAMMAN68
                          The Rams should have cap space next season from Warners release.
                          That would have been true had they released Warner prior to June 1st. But they spread the cap hit out over this season and next, meaning the Rams will have about $6.7M in dead money against their cap next season from Kurt. He's counting more next season than he will be this season.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Question about tommy polley

                            My bad Nick. I was never good with numbers. :disappoin
                            JUST WIN ONE FOR THE FANS
                            :ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram::ram:

                            "HIT HARD, HIT FAST, AND HIT OFTEN"
                            Adm. William "Bull" Halsey

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Question about tommy polley

                              Originally posted by txramsfan
                              I actually have a Polley jersey. Polley has his moments, but all in all seems to have the tools to be an awesome LB. He has speed, good coverage skills, but needs to improve on the run defense as does the whole unit. If Polley and the rest of this LB unit improves against the rush, we have to sign them all somehow. They are spaced out contractually that we may be able to afford this.
                              If the interior D-line is as good at run stopping as I think they are going to be this year, it should make the whole LB corp look better at defending the run.
                              The more things change, the more they stay the same.

                              Comment

                              Related Topics

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                              • ramhard
                                New Rams - Balance and Toughness
                                by ramhard
                                I've been thinking about the Rams and no matter the individual debates, the Rams have two problems:

                                (1). Lack of balance of talent due to salaries of the stars; and
                                (2). Lack of physical play (despite the players and coaches protests - see Atlanta game for reference and almost any others the past season).


                                The Rams can tinker but to be a champion again - not just making the players - will require them to remedy both of these.

                                On (1). The Rams can go the way of the Indy Colts and be entertaining during the season and lose in the playoffs, or can make some tough decisions. Here are the tough decisions. The Rams pay too much money right now to WR's, RB, and at one OT. There is no way the Rams can be balanced paying this much money to Bruce and Holt not to mention what Manu is paid at TE.
                                I say the Rams either drastically reduce Bruce's pay or trade him. I know it hurts and he is the heart of the team, but that is what every said when the Patriots traded Lawyer Milloy. The Rams just can't afford to have that much tied up at the receiver spot. I would also either cut or drastically restructure Faulk. He is not worth more than $1.5-$2M a year right now. You can't count on him for more than 9-10 games a year, and even then he is a solid but not spectacular back. Put it this way, if the Rams were on the free agent market to sign a back and they had Jackson, how much would you be willing to pay Faulk if he was a FA from another team? And Pace is a premier OT, but I think his contract issues have handcuffed the team. I would trade him also, and you could sign 2-3 solid linemen with that money.

                                Tough things do, but necessary.

                                (2). Speaking of tough that brings me to #2. The Rams are a finesse team - period, and can trick their way through the regualar season, but unless things fall right can't make it through the playoffs. So first of all the draft. Don't draft anyone that doesn't have in their scouting report - tough, physical, mean... period. No exceptions. As we already know that means, letting Pollley go, keeping Pisa, moving Thomas to ST and the bench, and bringing in two new LB's (I don't think Chillar is the answer). That also means one new corner in the rotation (nickle or starter) who is physical (maybe Lucas from Seattle), and a hard hitting safety who can cover. Plus drafting a G/T who can run block.

                                I know it's a overhaul, and that's why money has to be freed up. The capologist better than me can figure out the best way to clear cap room.
                                -02-06-2005, 09:22 PM
                              • general counsel
                                What are the odds that chillar returns?
                                by general counsel
                                I get the sense that chillar is gone for sure. Am i overeacting to the odds?

                                Some people i really respect on this board have stated that he is really a good but not great two down linebacker who is likely to get a very large payday due to the dearth of talent available on the open market. If he is among the best linebackers available, teams will pay up for him because they have the cap money to spend.

                                What does everyone think, will we pay up for him and should we pay up for him. those are two different questions.

                                ramming speed to all

                                general counsel
                                -02-15-2008, 12:14 PM
                              • Rams4Life
                                Does anyone really want Chillar back?
                                by Rams4Life
                                I mean, this guy took a beating on several Rams boards before this season. Now all of a sudden it seems allot of folks want him back.

                                To me, the Rams can do allot better. His season was ok, but not great. He may get better, but i don't know. I think Karlos Dansby of the Cards is a FA thus far and the Rams should pursue him. I think the Rams will sign a LB in free agency and draft one as well.

                                Will anyone here really miss Chillar?
                                -01-10-2008, 03:37 PM
                              • Will51
                                Question on our linebacker situation?
                                by Will51
                                Since the ravens failed to place the franchise tag on LB Adalius Thomas because they didnt want to pay him do you think we should take a shot at him? He is still young and he is a pro bowl OLB, he would be a HUGE up grade over chillar and watching him play he is a serious ball hawk, i kno most of you are worried about the DL but all the teams are tagging the defensive line stars (smith,grant etc,) we can draft some talent on the DL and do something big with our LB corps now, What do you guys think?
                                -02-23-2007, 09:10 AM
                              • txramsfan
                                My take on the team....for what it's worth
                                by txramsfan
                                I said this after the New Orleans game and I'll say it again, this version of the Rams is not very good but at least they are entertaining at times. The Rams are ranked 28th in total defense for the NFL. We may have the worst LB corp in the NFL. Outside of Pisa, the talent isn't there and for those of you crying for Lovie you can put a bunch of the blame on him for the state of this LB corp. The secondary has been banged up all year. Fisher gets back after his arm injury and what happens? Gets his jaw broke. Fights through that and what happens? Buffalo takes his knees out. Then our nickel guy Groce gets hurt, and our penny (can't say he's worth a dime) Garrett gets a concussion. This isn't the New England defense. Or the New England salary cap. Not sure you would call what we have Safeties unless you are an opposing teams TE that needs a confidence boost. Even Archuleta, though has been hurt, is having a rough year.

                                With the defense we have, and the money going to the offensive side of the ball, the offense had to be better. What happens? Turley and Wohlobaugh go out BEFORE OUR FIRST PRESEASON GAME. Uggghhh. That's worse than Lucy pulling the ball away before Charley Brown can kick it. Faulk is having a decent year but for the money he's making he isn't earning his salary. I've never seen him drop so many passes as he does now.

                                What does this mean? We better clean some house. Not coaching, players. Take pay cuts or go. Go out and get a slobber knocker LB. Let Aeneas retire and find a S. Tell Arch to lay off the pinky pushups which may impress the females but it dosen't do him a dad gum bit of good stopping a TE in the passing game. Ask Coady to go coach somewhere. Tell Garrett, who I had high hopes for this year, to find a relay team. Tommy Polley? Good luck in the FA market. Faulk? Either trim the salary or you get trimmed off the roster. Pace? We need three more lineman who want to play. Either sign long term or go to that "team" called the Browns. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
                                -11-23-2004, 07:05 AM
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