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Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

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  • Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

    In a thread posted on here two weeks ago discussing the defense, I said that they were clearly improved but that we should temper our excitement because we hadn't been playing very good offenses. Yesterday, we faced a pretty good offense so I thought it would be a good time to revisit the subject.

    Although we didn't get torched yesterday, I do think it showed that we had a way to go. First, despite shutting down the passing game, I think we can all agree that some of that has to do with the fact with the weather yesterday. The CBs played decently except for a few notable lapses (the dropped INT, e.g.), but I'd like to see them play that well in decent weather before I get *too* excited. The visions of Lenny Walls getting burned in Dallas are too recent for me to fall completely for these guys just yet. We also really need a safety who can come up and cover too.

    Second, we have no pass rush. Although we didn't blitz a ton yesterday, the Bengals offensive line did a good job of keeping us away from Palmer. Indeed, it showed that if our blitzes get picked up right now that we can't generate much pressure on the QB. If we got more from the ends in particular, it would help the defense take that next step.

    Finally, despite much improved play by the interior defensive line, they still have work to do. They absolutely got manhandled in the 4th quarter yesterday. Carricker is for real and Ryan is proably -- at worst -- a very good rotational player. Still, we need at least one other guy we can count on. I wonder if they've considered getting Adeyanju some reps at DT because he seems made for running downs and is a reliable tackler.

    In short, while the defense is obviously better, we're still a couple of players away from being "good" in my opinion. I'd really love to see a playmaking defensive end, better rotational depth on the interior line, and another safety. Interestingly, linebacker is at the bottom of my list...when was the last time we weren't concerned about linebackers?

  • #2
    Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

    Good post. I agree with all of your points. I think our D will be a force when our O sucks next year b/c Losehan is back. I'd like to see a DE/S/CB added... but mostly I am still think about another blitz heavy LB.

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    • #3
      Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

      Without Little, our pass rush suffers and yesterday it showed. There are going to be times during the season when the rush defense breaks down and yesterday was it. However, that was really the first game the defense gave up big yards against the run so I think it was just one of those days.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

        I disagree, Hill was out he is our best young CB. Tino was out, Little out. Our O was we no help for the D. Wade to me played ok for a young rookie. Ryan is better then just a good rotational player,he has played well all year.

        The D looked flat to me Sunday, I think that was the worst game they played all year.

        We also really need a safety who can come up and cover too.
        Here I agree with you.

        Add SS and DE.

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        • #5
          Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

          Originally posted by Rambos View Post

          The D looked flat to me Sunday, I think that was the worst game they played all year.
          The "D" looked flat???? They kept us in the game and scored our only Touchdown.:beer:
          sigpic :ram::helmet:

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          • #6
            Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

            This D is extremely improved from last year. How in the world can anyone say this was the worst game the D has played all year? Palmer averaged like 6.0 YPA and had a QB rating of 60.9. Other than the 52 yard pass to Ocho Cinco, he was terrible. He was very efficient at getting passes off with pressure in his face. There were points during the game where we were getting after him pretty good ...

            There is no doubt that is defensive front four got worn down yesterday. That is to be expected when the opponents have 36 rushing attempts and are on the field for long periods of times ...

            Our defensive backs are a strength of this team. However, there is one glaring problem back there and it is Corey Chavous, who has gotten a little slow with his age. This is why we consistently get burned by change of pace backs. It's not the front four's responsibility to bottle these guys up. It is usually the responsibility of the safety. When the DeDe Dorsey's of the league take pitches and bounce outside, there is no doubt the front four and the LB's are going to be contained. It is the responsibiltiy of the DB's and safeties to cover these plays. Otogwe is a gamer, but Chavous needs to be upgraded ...

            Chris Draft. Wow, he was a beast yesterday. If Pisa comes back and we resign Chillar, we've got a solid, if not very good, linebacking core. Chillar was huge again, with 7 tackles and 2 tackles for loss ...

            This defense has the potential to be very very good next year. James Hall has been a solid pickup, and has been in the backfield alot this year. If Leonard Little comes back healthy, we get a young stuf on the edge, and our young players continue to progress, watch out!

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            • #7
              Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

              In the beginning, it looked like we would get shredded after the Rudi johnson TD, but they seemed to settle down after that. Unfortunately, during the most important drive of the game in the 4th quarter, the Bengals ran the ball against us at will and wound up kicking the FG that put them up by two scores. I would have liked to see a more aggressive gameplan by Haslett- especially with Hill out and a 3rd string QB starting on offense, but I'd say that they played well overall. And what is up with the DBs dropping so many INTs this season??? It's like an Adam Archuleta flashback every week!!!

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              • #8
                Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

                Again, DB's dropping INT's is a problem all across the league. That's why they are DB's and not WR's. If DB's caught every INT that went to them, QB's would average 25 INT's a season ...

                Look at Bartell's INT, that was a great grab! It all happened in a split second ...

                Our secondary has developed very nicely, IMHO. QB's are completing 59.6% of their passes against us, 7.00 YPA, and a 80.6 QB rating. This basically means QB's are very average against us, and we've made some very good ones look bad ... i.e.. Hasselbeck, Palmer ...

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                • #9
                  Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

                  Originally posted by txramsfan View Post
                  Without Little, our pass rush suffers and yesterday it showed.
                  With Little our pass rush wasn't much to write home about this season. Even at his best, the Leonard Little of today isn't what he was just a few years ago. DE is the biggest need on the defensive end of the football and, arguably, has been for a couple of years.

                  Originally posted by txramsfan View Post
                  There are going to be times during the season when the rush defense breaks down and yesterday was it. However, that was really the first game the defense gave up big yards against the run so I think it was just one of those days.
                  Carolina, week #1 -- 186 yards, 4.9 ypc, 0TD
                  Tampa, week #3 -- 182 yards, 5.7 ypc, 3TD
                  Dallas, week #4 -- 171 yards, 5.2 ypc, 2TD
                  Cleveland, week #8 -- 132 yards, 4.6 ypc, 0 TD
                  Atlanta, week #11 -- 111 yards, 6.2 ypc, 0TD
                  Cincinnatti, week #12 -- 192 yards, 5.3 ypc, 1 TD

                  I don't see how you can say that this was "really the first game the defense gave up big yards against the run." I've listed the 6 worst games against the run we've had and at least three of them are comparable to what happened yesterday. I also didn't list 2 of the other games where the opponent rushed for 100 yards against us (making it 8/12 in which the opponent rushed for more than 100).

                  While I agree that our run defense is much improved, what I was trying to point out was that we're still not quite there. Perhaps the reason it looks better is that we were simply horrible the last few years, so this just looks great by comparison. But it isn't great; its merely better.

                  Don't get me wrong, I'm ecstatic about our improvement and think things are definitely looking up. But we're not "there" yet. And, with respect to run defense, we still need at least couple of defensive linemen and a safety.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

                    we may have a ways to go but we are going in the right direction,did you see Carriker bust up that screen pass yesterday,I think the fact that they were able to run late was that the defense was worn out, they spend to much time on the field,when your offense only scores 3 points the defense is on the field to much,in fact they outscored our offense yesterday,so we still need a few parts but I like where we are headed.

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                    • #11
                      Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

                      2004 - 136.2 YPG, 4.6 YPC
                      2005 - 136.1 YPG, 4.7 YPC
                      2006 - 145.4 YPG, 4.9 YPC
                      2007 - 115.7 YPG, 4.2 YPC

                      It's not smoke and mirrors, it's huge improvement. Further, we have not allowed a single 100 yard rusher all season (havent allowed a 100 yard back in 14 straight games). Go back and look at the box scores and you'll see that the big majority of big gainer runs are given up to change of pace backs like Norwood and Dorsey. For the most part, we've bottled up every starting running back we've faced. Rudi Johnson had the best game of the season by a starting RB against us with 23 carries for 92 yards ...

                      We need safety help against these speedy backs and Chavous just cannot do it ....

                      The rushing numbers against us are a little deceiving, due in part to giving up 94 yards on 8 carries to Norwood and 80+ yards on 4 carries to Dorsey ...

                      We need to get better at tackling runners in the open field, and containing outside. With that said, you cannot blame some of these big gainers on the front four or LB's. At some point, the secondary has to be accountable for what is going on in the running game ...

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                      • #12
                        Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

                        219 carries, 735 yards ...

                        3.5 YPC ...

                        This is what we've given up to the starting RB of opponents this year ...

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

                          I think we're at a point where we're not necessarily embarrassing ourselves anymore, but I don't think teams fear to play us either. I want to see our defense really have an impact on the game and force teams to adjust to us rather than the other way around. I want to be at a point of where Tampa's and Baltimore's defenses were a few years back and I'm just not convinced that Haslett is that type of guy anymore. I think he's gotten more conservative in his old age...

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                          • #14
                            Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

                            The "D" looked flat???? They kept us in the game and scored our only Touchdown.
                            Yeah I know they kept us in the game. But they gave up 195 yards on the ground. The rain was more a factor in that cinny did not have more passing for yards, but they gave up a hugh deep passing play. Only one sack and not really to many hit on the QB.

                            2007 - 115.7 YPG, 4.2 YPC we gave up 195 yards sunday that how, I can say it was the worst they looked. We almost gave up 100 yards to two running backs in one game.

                            How in the world can anyone say this was the worst game the D has played all year? Palmer averaged like 6.0 YPA and had a QB rating of 60.9.
                            I wonder if you guys see the games sometimes. It was a down pour, rainny mess, running the ball was the key,
                            Last edited by Rambos; -12-10-2007, 10:58 AM.

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                            • #15
                              Re: Rams defense...we still have a ways to go

                              Originally posted by RamsInfiniti View Post
                              2004 - 136.2 YPG, 4.6 YPC
                              2005 - 136.1 YPG, 4.7 YPC
                              2006 - 145.4 YPG, 4.9 YPC
                              2007 - 115.7 YPG, 4.2 YPC
                              I agree that we're headed in the right direction. I'm just trying to make sure people understand we haven't reached the destination.

                              The rushing numbers against us are a little deceiving, due in part to giving up 94 yards on 8 carries to Norwood and 80+ yards on 4 carries to Dorsey ...
                              What's deceptive about yards gained on the ground by running backs?

                              Comment

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                              • live4ramin
                                Could it be? Defense...
                                by live4ramin
                                My love of football is on the offensive side of the ball, particularly the offensive line. The blocking and the pride these guys have when they jel into one unit, usually without much in the way of credit.

                                But silently this team's defense just keeps getting a little better. If these guys can stay healthy and build a little pride in keeping the offense off the field Spags may turn this group of nobodies into something to get excited about.

                                I've never had a great defense to watch on Sundays. It was always time to grab a snack and a cold beverage. It could be a life changer for some of us.
                                -08-29-2010, 07:42 AM
                              • r8rh8rmike
                                If Anything, We Showed Some Heart
                                by r8rh8rmike
                                As bad as things were today, at least we know we have a group of guys who won't give up when things look desperate. This team could have easily folded when it was 28-9 late in the third quarter, but they dug down deep, righted the ship and calmly fought and scratched their way back to making it a game. They had me believing a comeback was possible and I'll bet they put the fear of God in the whiners and their fans right up to the final seconds.

                                I watched the Seattle game and parts of the Arizona game, and both of those squads crumpled under the pressure of being behind late. Heart matters and we've got it.
                                -09-11-2005, 07:10 PM
                              • RockinRam
                                Our defense
                                by RockinRam
                                I feel like our defense is a few players short from becoming a full-fledged solid unit, that may develop into a defensive powerhouse.

                                Our run defense week in and week out are continually stopping good running backs.

                                Our secondary is holding it's own against premier QBs and wide receivers when they have no pass rush help from our D-Line.

                                Our linebackers and D-Line are great at bottling up the run.

                                Lauranaitis is our man of the future. This kid is solid.

                                Gibson and Ryan showed a lot of improvement, as they kept on collapsing lanes.

                                Chris Long is always somehow around the ball.




                                What I think is if we add:

                                1 pass rushing DE
                                1 solid SLB
                                1 veteran corner

                                We will be in very good shape. Once Dorrell Scott develops, he and Lajuan Ramsey will make a very good rotational DT unit.


                                Plus the fact when we get a fully functional offense to help ease pressure off our defense, our defense is going to be very hard to break.
                                -10-12-2009, 09:23 AM
                              • DJRamFan
                                Kansas Weekly Football Press Conference Quotes
                                by DJRamFan
                                Sept. 13, 2005


                                Head Coach Mark Mangino

                                Opening statement:
                                "Good afternoon. Let me start with our players of the game vs. Appalachian State. On defense, Nick Reid. On offense, Jon Cornish. On special teams, Kyle Tucker. Our scout team defensive player of the week was Brandon Duncan and our scout team offensive player of the week was Tang Bacheyie."

                                "I would like to ask all fans attending the game this Saturday, if they would be kind enough to bring a dollar for the Red Cross Disaster Relief Fund in the Gulf and for the victims of Hurricane Katrina. It would be greatly appreciated."

                                "Now I'll talk quickly about last week's game. On the offensive side of the ball, I thought we did some good things in the passing game. I thought we were much more crisp when it came to running routes. I thought our offensive line continued to improve in both the run game and in pass protection. I felt like the game was managed well. It was very encouraging and I think we have a lot to build on."

                                "On the defensive side of the ball, it's hard to argue against a team that only gave up eight points, especially against a player like the Williams kid, who may be the best player in I-AA. We still are working in some young kids on defense and trying to get that edge back and the chemistry we need. Out on the practice field yesterday, which on Mondays is normally a light workout, you would have thought it was a scrimmage. Those young men know their expectations and nobody cares about that more than they do. Our defense is very good, but the expectations that they have for themselves are so high that they want to prove that we can be every bit as good this year as we were last year on defense."

                                "Special teams were good. I think we need to shore up a few things here and there on some of our kicking protections, but they are all correctable. Charles (Gordon) did a nice job with returns. Kyle Tucker booted the ball very, very well. He has a live leg and we have come to expect that from Kyle. Overall, I'm very pleased. As we had hoped, we made a lot of progress from week one to week two. We plan to continue to build on week two and progress into week three."

                                "Louisiana Tech is a good football team. Traditionally, they are very good, physical, and have a lot of speed. They will be physical up front in the trenches. They have great speed at the skill positions. They have a wide receiver that is very fast. Their quarterback, Matt Kubik, is very mobile and can throw the ball very well. He had a great day against Tennessee last year. These guys are used to playing major conference schools. In the last five or six years, they have defeated Alabama, Michigan State, and gave a heck of a game to Penn State. They are a good, hard-nosed team. We have to be well-prepared for them, and based on what I saw yesterday on the...
                                -09-13-2005, 04:03 PM
                              • rNemesis
                                HOW CLOSE IS THIS TEAM TO COMPETING?(VERY LONG)Please provide feedback
                                by rNemesis
                                First of all let me just say that these last few years have been VERY frustrating and embarassing for me as a RAM FAN and I'm sure you guys are just as disappointed. I have watched my team go from the greatest show on turf to, as a washington post columnist said after the redskins loss, " the most miserable mass on grass". MY main question here is , " How far are the rams from being a decent competitive rock solid team? Its a long way to go; it doesnt happen overnight but it shouldnt take FOREVER either.


                                But I am not gonna sit here and talk about that all night. We know what has happened. We know what we've become. 13 straight losses dating back to last season. 3-13 in 2007 and 2-14 in 2008. 5 wins in the last 30 or so games? ( not sure exactly the stats) That is horrible.

                                Let's go back year by year as to how we finished record wise.
                                In the 1990's we were bad. But so were other teams which are now good today. But if you look at our 90's record to others, you will see that we were bad most of those years. Other teams had bad years too during the 90's but it was only really the lions, bengals, cardinals and saints. That should show you how bad of a team the Rams are. We never finished over 7 wins from 1990 up until 1999, which was our superbowl year. Which now tells me that the Rams have been bad, are now bad, and I hope we dont continue to be bad. But lately one has to believe that that is the penalty for our actions.

                                2000- 10-6 DECENT
                                2001- 14-2 ( excellent; we beat the pats that season but lost in the SB to the same :|)
                                2002- 7-9 Not bad
                                2003- 12-4 excellent
                                2004- 8-8 not bad; competitive
                                2005- I think we were 7-9 or 6-10 cant remember
                                2006- 8-8
                                2007- 3-13 horrible
                                2008- 2-14 lousy

                                I am not surprised at how we have fallen so badly. What I cant seem to understand is how fast we have fallen as such. How come we havent been able to stop the bleeding and bounce back like other teams have seemed to?

                                So tell me guys. How far off is this team from competing? Well, I look at the league and I have noticed that most of the other teams have playmakers in a lot of key positions. Why is that? Because they do a great job of DRAFTING PLAYERS THAT FIT INTO THEIR SCHEME WELL. We on the other hand have not done that lately. We have drafted players that have done well IN THEIR SCHEME and so it didnt matter to the previous regime ( Jay ZYgmunt ) if they fit or not the point was they wanted them so much that they drafted them regardless of their college scheme and success. In the era since Martz left, we have drafted the likes of busts ( or so they appear to be) like Tye Hill, Adam Carriker, Claude Wroten, Fakhir Brown, etc. The list goes on and on.

                                THIS HAS REALLY HURT THIS ORGANIZATION SO MUCH THAT IT IS REARING ITS UGLY HEAD NOW. Bad drafting has put us in such a talentless hole that...
                                -09-29-2009, 06:43 PM
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