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Sharpe: "Either marry the guy or let someone else marry him."

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  • Sharpe: "Either marry the guy or let someone else marry him."

    Leave it to Sharpe to provide such vibrant commentary on the Pace situation.

  • #2
    Re: Sharpe: "Either marry the guy or let someone else marry him."

    But I have never, ever heard of a happy, succesful lasting marriage where one side says these are my demands, take them or leave them. There has to be give and take, compromise, to make any relationship work. In the short term, ie a one night stand, people can function together for all types of reasons, but in the long term, both the parties needs have to be addressed. As long as Pace wants to be paid like a QB, we have no shot at signing him and he is in effect not trying to "marry" us, only trying to extort us.

    Notwithstanding the foregoing, he is worth more than robert gallery got, which i believe is more than ogden got, and remember that winslow, a poston client, got 16.5 million up front and pace is for sure worth more than that and an offensive tackle is worth more than the tight end.

    This is what i mean about a two way street. If it is going to work, pace has to value himself like a top notch left tackle and the rams need to adjust for changing market conditions, since the replacement cost is going up rapidly, keeping in mind also that the pie is getting bigger as the salary cap increases as revenues increase.

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel

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    • Guest's Avatar
      Pace on the Open Market
      by Guest
      One of the themes that people keep coming back to on Pace is that he should take less to remain a ram, to make the same kind of sacrifices that others have made for the benefit of the squad.

      Putting aside the issue of how short the careers of these guys are and the beating they take, i want to make a different point. Who says pace isnt prepared to take less, in fact considerably less, than he would get on the open market.\

      From balzers comments, the issue appears to be mainly the structure of Walter Jones contract and how the front end money affects our cap. I believe that Pace is worth far more than what jones got, because i believe that jones was worth more than what jones got (ie jones took less to stay in seattle than he would have gotten in the open market)

      Have you guys seen the money that above average players are getting? Does anyone doubt that if Pace were an unrestricted free agent with no compensation required he wouldnt get $20 mill or more up front from someone? Do you really believe that champ bailey, who got $17 million up front is better than Pace (corners age faster than tackles). What about the money robert gallery got and he hadnt played a down in the nfl.

      Bottom line. Pace's negotiating position Post Poston appears to me to be that he WILL take less than pure open market. We have cap problems due to warner, turley and other decisions we have made and i dont think that the best player on our team, which is pace, should be expected to suffer for that.

      If we trade him, wait until you see what he signs for with another team and then you can see how much less we offered him than his actual value.

      There is just no evidence at this point to suggest that pace is demanding full market value. Why should he get less than walter jones just because of our situation. We need to find a way to make it work.

      Sign the Big Man.

      general counsel
      -03-14-2005, 07:16 AM
    • Guest's Avatar
      Simple question on Pace
      by Guest
      This topic IS worthy of beating what is hopefully not a dead horse.

      We are an 8-8 team that won a playoff game that had MAJOR problems on our offense line last year. Our best defensive player may or may not be incarcerated by the time we start the season. Cap or no cap, exactly HOW is trading away our best offensive lineman, and one of the best in the league, a guy who even if he didnt have his best season got beat only a handful of times all year and NEVER requires double team help on the qbs blind side, going to help our chances of improving the team in 2005 and beyond. We are not a rebuilding team.

      Furthermore, we still dont have a RIGHT tackle, let alone anyone remotely competent to replace pace. IF we get another left tackle, as avenger says, that is one thing, but the odds of getting a guy even in the same ballpark as pace for 2005 are very, very limited in my view.

      Guys its about performance, even if he isnt willing to discount to market to stay with the team, even if he is selfish, even if he is a distraction, how exactly do you figure that we are better off without him.

      If we spend the money we save on defense, how are we going to protect the qb.

      How much do you think we are actually going to save under the cap. Pace costs 8.2 under the tender. What do you think its going to cost to replace him. Until you replace him, you dont know what the net savings are, and given what left tackles go for these days, i dont think we are going to save anywhere near what some people think we are going to save, and we will in all liklihood be overpaying for inferior talent.

      Very, very sensitive subject for me, i think when people talk about the Big Three that won us the sb title and led to the great run this team has had, Pace is so often overlooked as to the critical nature of his contribution.

      ramming speed to all

      general counsel
      -03-13-2005, 08:47 PM
    • AvengerRam_old
      The Way I See It, Nobody Is To Blame For Pace Standoff
      by AvengerRam_old
      Who's wrong here?

      Orlando Pace wants a long-term deal, and believes that he should get the "market rate." He was not offered as much as Walter Jones (though it was close) received from Seattle, so he believes that the Rams have underbid. While the numbers make it hard to accept, there is a certain logic there. After all, Pace is at least Jones' equal.

      The Rams want to keep Pace, but need to make a good economic decision. The deal that Jones received is structured in such a way thati, if offered to Pace, would hardly even result in a cap savings under the franchise tender. They feel they have made a fair offer and that their spending should not be entirely dictated by Seattle's decision to perhaps overspend. Again, this is logical. If they are going to let him go, they want the franchise player rate - two number ones. That is also logical.

      Houston wants Pace and apparently is willing to give him an acceptable contract. But they don't want to give up two number 1 picks to get him. That makes sense, as few players are worth two #1s, and I don't think anyone has ever paid such a price for an O lineman. I presume they are willint to offer one first round pick and something else. The question is, what have they offered? Have they even made an offer?

      I still want Pace to sign long term, but I'm starting to accept that this won't happen. I also think Pace may be halfway out the door, and that makes him a dangerous player to keep. I think the Rams need to get a first round pick, one of the Texans' starting OTs, and maybe another pick (a 3rd round pick, perhaps) to make the deal.

      Stay tuned.
      -03-15-2005, 07:36 AM
    • Guest's Avatar
      Orlando Pace-the devil is in the details
      by Guest
      This is for sure the most spirited debate of the off season. Lets do our best not to let the two camps of view get personal with each other as in the bulgerite vs. warnerite debacle of a year ago.

      I think that there is really no "keep him" or "trade him" answer that makes 100% sense. The devil is in the details.

      It makes no sense to me to say keep him at any cost and it makes no sense to me to say trade him because he is a bad influence or its time to "get what we can and move on".

      Bottom line-If we trade him, does it make us a better team than signing him for what he wants or continuing to play the tag game. The answer to that questions is THE DEVIL IS IN THE DETAILS.

      We need to know what are we going to get specifically and how specifically is it going to affect our cap. We then compare that to what it does to our cap and our other personnel choices if we pay him what walter jones got.

      Here is my question for you guys as i do my best to fight through my love for orlando pace and my view of his enormously underated value to the team. If we get the #13 pick (alex barron), a starting right tackle (we need to know the cap value) a #3 pick (who will add depth, play special teams and be a potential future starter) AND save enough cap money to either sign bryce fisher or a safety or interior lineman, are the rams a better team?

      Your views please.

      general counsel
      -03-15-2005, 10:06 AM
    • general counsel
      The Big Man-orlando pace
      by general counsel
      As av pointed out, we are nowhere without the big man. I dont know why he missed the one series at the end of the half, but willig sure got toasted on the one pass play. We take the big man for granted at times, he is such a critical guy for us. You guys think we have problems on the line now, without him we have no shot at all.

      ramming speed to all

      general counsel
      -09-18-2005, 06:55 PM
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