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Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

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  • Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

    it is now time to blow up the coaching staff, and that includes your idol, Mike Martz.

    he is clearly not able to judge talent.
    he is clearly not able to adjust his game plan to a changing league.
    he is clearly not the genius everyone made him out to be.

    the sad part is, he still thinks he is, and therein lies the problem. he thinks he can still out-fox other coaches in the league and has not realized that everyone has figured out his "complex" system.

    time for him to go ( or go back to OC ).
    time for his buddy Marmie to go.
    time for some major changes with the coaching staff.

    we cannot afford to blow up the D for the 2nd time in 4 years in hopes that it will solve what ails our beloved team.

    it's time to look deep this time.

  • #2
    Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

    & who's out there to pick up????


    • #3
      Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

      we'll see when the season ends.

      all I know is that you can't stay with something that is not working anymore.

      this season is not just about the defense. the offense has not been able to produce this year either ( 260+ points ). the Rams are usually around 400+ by now.


      • #4
        Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

        Originally posted by lakerams
        he is clearly not able to judge talent.
        I think both sides could make equally long lists of the respective hits and misses Martz has had. To say he clearly isn't able to judge talent is incorrect, in my opinion.


        • #5
          Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

          he can judge talent? really?

          let's see. he said War... was washed up, but Chandler and Martin aren't.
          he leaves Jason Shiver's exposed on the practice squad and Rich Coady is missing tackles on the field.

          and don't get me started about the last 4 drafts.


          • #6
            Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

            undefinedAt least blow-up Marmie and whoever's running the special-ed teams. Ever since that Arizona fool showed-up, other teams act like they're playing the Cardinals. And the Dams don't disappoint.

            :ramlogo: :ramlogo:
            Last edited by Tom_SF; -12-19-2004, 06:20 PM. Reason: change font


            • #7
              Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

              Originally posted by lakerams
              and don't get me started about the last 4 drafts.
              You mean the drafts where he took Steven Jackson, Tony Hargrove, Pisa Tinoisamoa, Kevin Curtis, Shaun McDonald, Scott Tercero, Robert Thomas, Travis Fisher, Chris Massey, Adam Archuleta, Jerametrius Butler?

              Like I said, we could both make equally impressive lists of various hits and misses. To say he can't judge talent at all is ridiculous, and doesn't even take into consideration the other parts of the organization responsible for reviewing incoming talent.


              • #8
                Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

                you mean the years we drafted Canidate, D. Lewis, R. Pickett, L. Gordon, R. Thomas, Steve Bellisari, Eric Crouch and passed on guys like Marcus Stroud, Kris Jenkins, Scott Fujita and Nate Clements? are those the drafts youare referring to?

                yes, there are hits and misses. but Martz has more misses than hits and the 2001 draft was the worst because we had a truckload of picks and wasted most of them.


                • #9
                  Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

                  Lakerams, you're missing my point. This isn't about having more misses and hits, and this is exactly why I didn't want to go into detail in my original response. All I was saying is that it's ridiculous to say he is "clearly not able to judge talent" because he has a number of hits that prove otherwise. That's all I'm saying.


                  • #10
                    Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

                    Is it not amazing that people end up arguing about draft picks?

                    And you know what.

                    The Rams have been held up on high as one of the BETTER teams since Martz has came on board. Everyone points to the Rams and says that they have drafted better.

                    But here comes the whiners ...... yea, yea, Martz drafted crap ........... sigh

                    Keeping the Rams Nation Talking


                    • #11
                      Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

                      c'mon.... this is bs

                      under Martz we have had some ABYSMAL drafts... to take 3 DL in the 1st round and not have one that excels is just plain CRAZY... to draft a whole LB corp and still have no results is POOR... to not draft OL when clearly the veterans are breaking down is INCOMPETANT.

                      Yes we have had our successes ( I wouldn't say HITS)...

                      You mean the drafts where he took Steven Jackson, Tony Hargrove, Pisa Tinoisamoa, Kevin Curtis, Shaun McDonald, Scott Tercero, Robert Thomas, Travis Fisher, Chris Massey, Adam Archuleta, Jerametrius Butler?
                      but tell me from that lot which is a league STAR or even a PRO BOWLER ????!!!??? closest we have is Pisa.

                      Can't believe we are arguing this when the facts speak for themselves!!


                      • #12
                        Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

                        Yea, I canny believe that your arguing either ;)

                        Keeping the Rams Nation Talking


                        • #13
                          Re: Time To Blow Up The Coaching Staff.....

                          Originally posted by elAcky
                          but tell me from that lot which is a league STAR or even a PRO BOWLER ????!!!??? closest we have is Pisa.
                          I think it would be futile to measure a draft class by how many Pro Bowlers one gets. Some teams are lucky to have a handful of Pro Bowlers on their entire roster, let alone a single draft class or two.

                          Rather, are these players effective members of the team? Our 2001 defensive tackles are starting to come around now that they're allowed to play at more comfortable weights. The others listed who haven't proven their worth yet have shown enough potential to leave me optimistic.

                          All of this though is only to counter the comment that Martz clearly has no ability to judge talent. Apparently Martz is the one who gets blamed for picks like Eric Crouch, Trung Canidate, and Steve Bellisari, but gets no credit for Steven Jackson, Pisa Tinoisamoa, Travis Fisher, Jerametrius Butler, or the two 2003 receivers who look pretty good this season. Interesting how that works.

                          If I burned myself heating up the chili I ate at halftime, I wouldn't be surprised if someone suggested it was Martz's fault that I got hurt.


                          Related Topics


                          • RamWraith
                            Martz's remedies need to extend to coaching staff
                            by RamWraith
                            By Bryan Burwell
                            Of the Post-Dispatch

                            So as we have reached the critical midway point of the 2004 NFL season, it's time for a little review. The Rams' offensive line can't block a fire exit. Their defense gets exploited regularly. And because I am a positive person, let me be the first to note that the Rams' special teams haven't botched any kick coverage in the last 12 hours (I think), nor surrendered a single touchdown pass thrown by an opposing team's backup long snapper in months.

                            So now that it's painfully obvious that the 4-4 Rams are a broken and flawed football team, what we need to know now are the answers to two very important questions as they head into the second half of the season:

                            1. How do they fix it?

                            2. Can they fix it?

                            On Monday morning, as he sat in his Rams Park second-floor office, Mike Martz finished reviewing game tapes of Sunday's 40-22 debacle against the New England Patriots and began answering those pressing questions with a very systematic, analytical process. After scrutinizing hours of game tape, Martz met with his coaching staff and he met with his players. Then after carefully listening, observing and analyzing every scrap of forensics from this mess of a half-season, the boss essentially came to this conclusion:

                            It can be fixed, and he has the available tools to fix it.

                            Oh yeah, and there was just one other valuable little tidbit that we thought we ought to share with you . . .

                            Our favorite gray-haired football eccentric is mad as hell and he ain't gonna take it anymore.

                            "You guys have been here long enough to know that I've never tried to mislead you or sugarcoat anything," Martz told a room full of reporters at his Monday afternoon news conference. "If I've screwed something up I'll tell you. I'll try to take a bullet (for players) when you can to help them. (But) there comes a time when some of these guys have just got to ... show up and make a play. That's not a cop-out or brushing it off onto (the players). But I'm upset. We've got some guys we're counting on and they've got to step up."

                            There is no greater theatre than a Monday afternoon Martz news conference following a Rams loss. But this one was better than others, exceptionally rich with subtle insight and read-between-the-lines intrigue. To the untrained eyes and ears, it sounded a whole lot like Martz was just lashing out at his players, and placing all the weight of the world on their shoulders.

                            Yet to veteran Martz-ologists who understand his rhythms, moods and intentions, these were not the blame-shifting ramblings of a desperate man in his final days. This was a strategic angry declaration of a head coach who still believes he can lead this team out of its misery. And is it possible that we also might have been hearing a few subtle...
                            -11-09-2004, 01:18 PM
                          • Guest's Avatar
                            by Guest
                            The loss today is not the important issue regarding the Rams.

                            If Seattle comes in and steals a win from the Rams it’s going to suck however that is not the important issue facing the Rams.

                            If we miss the playoffs that will really bite the big one however this is not what concerns me the most.

                            What concerns me the most is the direction this team is going. This team seems to go in the direction that they are in the mood for that day. They have shown they can play football, they have shown they are capable of becoming motivated however that motivation is usually absent and it seems that no body in the organization is able to take charge and get the team motivated to play ball at the level they are capable of.

                            It's not always the head coach that is the motivator. Some people just cannot rally others together as well as others. It doesn't necessarily have to be the head coach that motivates a team but it sure as hell is his responsibility to see that someone gets it done.

                            The Ravens have Ray Lewis but who's our guy? Anyone care to take a shot at naming our motivator? The truth is, our motivators have been cut, traded or just plain shat on by the Rams. London Fletcher may have not been the best linebacker that played the game but he sure as hell brought his attitude with him on Sundays. Billy Jenkins, Roman Phifier, Rickey Prohel, Az Hakim, Dre Bly Todd Kichen, Toby Wright all had the ability to get the team going.

                            So out go those guys and in comes Kyle Turley who in my mind was the final straw on the Rams breaking back. He may have been a motivator but his motivation was clearly from his own selfish agenda which was to dismantle the team starting with Warner then take a years hiatis while the smoke cleared.

                            So now we are left with the crumbled aftermath and we do not know which direction this team is headed. That is the important issue facing the Rams right now.

                            Which way are we going and how far must we fall before considerable changes are made.

                            I know I am the minority in this but I think that head coaches should not be given the lead way they are given when it comes down to hiring their staff. To many of them use the good old boy system of repaying people who employed them in another era or just want to help out a buddy. Sure it's noble to repay someone for helping you out along the way but at what expense? When is it ok to say no? If i'm not mistaken didn't Martz also hire a high school coach out of San Diego using the same good old boy system?

                            The statement made by Martz regarding calling the defense on the one play when the Rams were torched for a TD last week Vs. Miami didn't make a lick of sense and when something doesn't make sense someone is usually lying. Anyone believe Martz's statement or can you now see the cover-up taking place for Marmie or more specifically Martz's decision to hire...
                            -11-07-2004, 09:49 PM
                          • RamsFanSam
                            HC Speculation...
                            by RamsFanSam
                            I know a lot of you guys are tired of the guessing game about who will be coming to St. Louis. We might know as early as tomorrow what is going on in the front office.
                            There are supposed to be a number of openings for head coaches after this season ends. Saint Louis, Houston, Detroit, Oakland, Kansas City, even Green Bay and Phoenix, among others, may need to fill the position. But it seems to me that there is a shortage of qualified candidates to fill those positions. Only a couple of teams will end up with someone who will make a difference. Those who get the best will have to act fast and pay well. Teams who do not have a new coach signed by the middle of January will most likely be offering unqualified candidates way too much money.
                            In Saint Louis, the Front Office seems to have quieted down over the past four weeks. After a season filled with questionable comments, threats, rumors, backstabbing, and everything else that makes a soap opera happen, December has been relatively quiet. Of course, there has been a few rumors floating about, but nothing has really come out of there that sounds believable.
                            This makes me wonder...could things in St. Louis be different than we are led to believe? Have Kroenke and Georgia put their respective feet down?
                            There is no doubt that the coaching staff is in need of overhaul. The once unstoppable Rams are now in need of direction. With the lack of qualified Head Coaches to fill a large number of spaces, what will the Rams end up doing?
                            Mike Martz has made many enemies out of friends with his coaching style, but even the front office can see that his record is better than most of the people being considered for his job. He has made many questionable decisions, Marmie being among the worst, and has ignored the advice of his assistants. He has, in fact, taken on more power in his position than would be advisable.
                            I, for one, would not be too surprised to see a change in the FO personnel. Too much has been said and done this past year to ignore. The owners may have had enough, and are only waiting until the end of this season to let some people go. Others will stay, but will basically be castrated, and not wield the influence they once had.
                            If this does end up happening, would Martz return for another year, but in a more limited fashion? Would the FO offer him a deal that would have him return as HC, but fire his cronies and reduce his power to run things his way? Even if such an offer were tendered, would he accept?
                            The chances of such a scenario are slim, but there is still a chance that it will happen. Martz knows his health is an issue, and the stresses of his job are a contributing factor.
                            I would not be shocked to see a press release stating that the Rams are in negotiations with Martz to retain him for 2006. After this year, I wouldn't doubt much of anything.
                            -01-01-2006, 07:31 AM
                          • Guest's Avatar
                            I don’t buy this "no talent" thing
                            by Guest
                            Heard people say this a lot… I really don’t buy this on the defensive side of the ball (though I agree there is a definite lack of talent on OL)… almost every player (maybe exception being Coady and D Lewis ) has at some point shown a lot of promise.. feels like yesterday we were all praising Polley and had Arch penciled in as a future pro bowler… why then have they all suddenly forgotten how to tackle or make a play ? Doesn’t sound like a talent issue to me…

                            My theory is that it is purely a question of motivation…. Martz has lost his ability to motivate this lot… I think a lot has to do with the way he has critisied his players openly (and maybe been a bit too trigger happy in demoting some players) and indeed been praised himself eventhough he has prepared his team poorly… I have a sneaking suspicion that this team is ready to break out of its slumber - but only once Martz leaves or puts his hand up and admits guilt.
                            -11-25-2004, 05:20 AM
                          • AvengerRam_old
                            Of architects, sculptors and Martz
                            by AvengerRam_old
                            On a plane ride back from vacation yesterday, a guy sitting next to me noticed I was reading a football magazine, and we started talking about the NFL. He was of the opinion that coaching is extremely important to a team's success and (not surprisingly, as this leg of the flight originated in Dallas), mentioned Bill Parcells as an example.

                            This got me thinking about the question of what makes a great coach.

                            Here's what I concluded... there are two types of coaches. There are architects and there are sculptors.

                            Architects start with a detailed plan and then try to built a team that fits that plan. It could be a "pound-it-out" ground game plan, a West Coast offense, a "run and shoot" or any other type of plan for success. The positive side of a good "architect," is that when they get the right players in place, a good plan can be hard to beat. The downside is that it is often hard to get (and to keep healthy) the right type of players, and when players that fit the plan are absent, the architect coach can have trouble adjusting and may stubbornly try to keep with the plan despite the missing pieces.

                            Sculptors start with the building blocks of a team (the "clay," if you will), and then mold it into a finished product. The result is often dictacted, not by a plan, but rather by the nature of the materials. This is the type of coach that is often described as "getting the most of his players," and having a team of "overachievers." The truth is, its not a matter of overachieving, its playing to the strengths of individuals. The positive side of the sculptor is his flexibility and ability to turn a team around quickly. The downside is that there are true few sculptors and too many coaches who think they are, but are not.

                            There have been successful architects. Bill Walsh may be the best example, as he built a team with the West Coast offense blueprint to perfection. Another was Jimmy Johnson, who built a team in Dallas with his blueprint and then failed to do the same in Miami because he lacked the right players (mainly the lack of a Emmitt Smith type back).

                            There have also been great sculptors. Don Shula comes to mind, as he used the ground game in the 70s when he had Czonka, Kiick and Morris, then became a "passing coach" when he had Dan Marino. Parcells may be the consummate sculptor given his success with several teams (though some might argue he is really an architect with a one word blueprint: toughness).

                            So where does Mike Martz fit in here?

                            Clearly, he is an architect. He can sit in an office and devise an offense that, when properly staffed, can be nearly unstoppable. But his flexibility and ability to adjust when he has to deviate from the blueprint is questionable.

                            Being the eternal optimist that I am, I hope he will improve...
                            -08-02-2004, 12:43 PM